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Sharn Penndroen |
Posted: Jun 20 2004, 05:43
AM
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![]() Lemming Extraordinare ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 248 Member No.: 15 Joined: 15-January 04 ![]() |
Okay, I'm just going to jump in here and throw at
something that I've been working on for a while. For those of you who like
the Weave Slot system and think that it represents the books well, you
won't like this. For those of you who think that the DnD spell system with
a few changed names just doesn't quite fit the One Power, I've got
something for you to look at. I'm going to preface this by saying that my knowledge of the Star Wars Force System is extremely limited, I don't have the SW books and only know what I've been told. That being said, I've tried to maintain most of the principles of Wheel of Time channeling that are appropriate for the books. I've also tried to maintain some semblace of balance, but be forwarned, I've not play tested this yet. There is a lot to look over, and I'd really appreciate some good feedback and diretion, especially from those of you who have written new weaves and monkeyed around with the system a little of your own. Some of this might not be super clear, since I understand what I've written because I'm the one who thought of it. If something is unclear please tell me so that I can try to make it more clear. I'll give a link to the .rtf so that the tables can be viewed well for the new channeling classes. I'll also paste it here for your viewing pleasure. **Edited the System** I've taken some of the suggestions listed here and opted for using the Talents as the Skills. Aleshandre helped me pick which abilities to use to modify the Talent Skills, and I thank him for that. I've updated the link below to contain the revised version. So you can look over that. To save those of you who have already read it from reading it again to see what changed, I've edited the Talent section to explain how the Talent skills work. I've also listed which abilities modify the Talent skills they are as follows: Balefire (Int) Cloud Dancing (Wis) Conjunction (Cha) Earth Singing (Int) Elementalism (Int) Healing (Wis) Illusion (Cha) Traveling (Wis) Warding (Cha) I also edited the Classes under the Power section to say that the channeler starts knowing 8 common weaves. For those Talents that a channeler has, the Talent Skill is a permanent Class skill. For those Talents that they don't have, the Talent skill is a Cross-Class skill. Weaves are still learned the same, now they simply must make a Talent Skill check to perform a weave and pay the Weave Cost in subdual damage (or VP is you are doing a WP/VP system). I also added Damane as a Tradition. Even though I don't think it is playable for a PC, it is possible that I am not creative enough. Others could quite possibly use this and if for nothing else it will be needed for NPCs. Here is the link of the new version: New Channeling System Here is the new form copied for you. Channeling (By: Blaine Britt) Channeling is accomplished by manipulating the 5 elements of the True Source. Doing this require some degree of skill. Some special is certain areas, while other in other areas. Proficiency varies greatly as does diversity. Weave Checks: After embracing the Source a channeler can attempt to manipulate it to form a desired effect. Depending on what he or she is trying to do, the DC may be high or low. For every 10 points that the channeler beats the DC of the weave, he reduces the cost by 2 hp. If he fails by 5 or more, then he must make a Fort save equal to 10 plus the DC of the weave attempted. If the save is failed see the table on page 163 of the Wheel of Time RPG for the results of the failure. You may never take a 10 or a 20 on Weave checks. Each Talent Skill is affected by one ability score. The modifier from that ability is applied to all weave checks for that Talent skill. Weave Cost: After a Weave Check is succeeded, the channeler receives a certain amount of subdual damage. This is treated as any other subdual damage. If the channeler receives subdual damage from weave cost or any other source totally to his current hit points, he becomes unconscious. Subdual damage heals at a rate of 1 hp / level / hour. Affinities: Channelers posses affinities for ceratin elements of the True Source. Each Weave uses one or more of these Elements. If a channeler possesses none of the affinities associated with a weave, the DC and Weave Cost are increased by 2. If a channeler possesses all of the affinities associated with a weave, the DC and Weave Cost are decreased by 2. Talents: Talents are groups of weaves that are related to one another. When a channeler has a Talent, that skill becomes a permanent class skill. She must still learn the weaves before being able to perform them. For Talents that a channeler does not possess (has not taken the Additional Talent Feat to gain it) she may treat those Talent Skills as cross-class skills. Wilders automatically learn a new weave every level. Channelers can learn weave by seeing it done and making a Weavesight check equal to 5 + the DC of the Weave. The Following is a list of Talent Skills and the abilities that modify them. Balefire (Int) Cloud Dancing (Wis) Conjunction (Cha) Earth Singing (Int) Elementalism (Int) Healing (Wis) Illusion (Cha) Traveling (Wis) Warding (Cha) Note: To convert Weaves from the Weave Slot system, the DC of a weave is equal to 10 + 2 x Casting Level. The Weave cost is equal to 2 x Casting Level. A few examples are given below. I'm in the process of converting them over. Channeling Hero Classes: Channelers have different focal points in their training and preferences. Some rely heavily on the One Power, while some still prefer to use more mundane means hightened by the One Power. Some are scholars, warriors, or healers. Below are listed 3 channeling classes. A character must have atleast one level in one of these classes to be considered a channeler and thereby take Channeling Feats and Channeling Skills. Once a character has selected one of these channeling classes, she may not select another one. She has developed her prefered method and will generally stick with it. Warrior Channeler (By: Blaine Britt) Hit Die: d8 Class Skills The warrior channeler's class skills (and the key ability for each skill) are Composure (Wis), Concentration (Wis), Craft (Int), Intimidate (Cha), Invert (Int), Jump (Str), Ride (Dex), and Weavesight (Int). Skill Points at 1st Level: (4 + Int modifier) x 4. Skill Points at Each Additional Level: 4 + Int modifier. Table: The Warrior Channeler Level Base Attack Bonus Fort Save Ref Save Will Save Def Rep Special 1 +1 +2 +1 +1 +3 0 Channeling Tradition 2 +2 +3 +2 +2 +4 1 Bonus channeling feat 3 +3 +3 +2 +2 +4 1 Slow aging 4 +4 +4 +2 +2 +4 1 Bonus armsman feat 5 +5 +4 +3 +3 +5 2 6 +6/+1 +5 +3 +3 +5 2 Bonus channeling feat 7 +7/+2 +5 +4 +4 +6 3 8 +8/+3 +6 +4 +4 +6 3 Bonus armsman feat 9 +9/+4 +6 +4 +4 +6 3 10 +10/+5 +7 +5 +5 +7 4 Bonus channeling feat 11 +11/+6/+1 +7 +5 +5 +7 4 12 +12/+7/+2 +8 +6 +6 +8 5 Bonus armsman feat 13 +13/+8/+3 +8 +6 +6 +8 5 14 +14/+9/+4 +9 +6 +6 +8 5 Bonus channeling feat 15 +15/+10/+5 +9 +7 +7 +9 6 16 +16/+11/+6/+1 +10 +7 +7 +9 6 Bonus armsman feat 17 +17/+12/+7/+2 +10 +8 +8 +10 7 18 +18/+13/+8/+3 +11 +8 +8 +10 7 Bonus channeling feat 19 +19/+14/+9/+4 +11 +8 +8 +10 7 20 +20/+15/+10/+5 +12 +9 +9 +11 8 Bonus armsman feat Class Features: All of the following are class features of the warrior channeler. Weapon and Armor Proficiency: The warrior channeler is proficient with all simple and martial weapons. Warrior channelers are not proficient with any type of armor, nor with shields. The One Power: Channelers draw upon the Five Powers of the True Source to cast arcane weaves. Affinities: Your channeler begins play with an Affinity for one of the Five Powers (Air, Earth, Fire, Spirit, or Water). If your channeler is female choose your Affinity from among Air, Spirit, and Water. If your channeler is male choose your Affinity from among Earth, Fire, and Spirit. Your channeler can gain more Affinities with the Additional Affinity feat. Talents and Weaves: Your channeler begins play having one common Talent. That Talent Skill is a permanent class skill for him. A channeler can gain more Talents with the Additional Talent feat. He also begins play knowing 8 common weaves. As the game progresses, your channeler can learn new weaves through observation and training. See the Weavesight skill description for more information. Cross-Talent Weaves: A channeler may spend skill points in Talent skills that he doesn't have, but they are considered Cross-Class skills. Channeling Tradition: A channeler is usually a member of a channeling tradition. The Tradition teaches the channeler not only how to channel but also teachs him a value system. Channeling traditions vary by culture and gender. Each channeler begins play as part of a certain tradition. Aes Sedai: In Tar Valon, the White Tower houses the ancient tradition of the Aes Sedai. In times past, both men and women have been part of the tradition. Since the Breaking, it has only consisted of women. It has also developed into 7 Ajahs, each of which has a different focus. Besides being strong in the Power, they have politic power as well. Kings and Queens show respect to the Aes Sedai, if only in public. Benefits: Aes Sedai gain a +4 to their Weavesight checks. Requirements: Female only. Damane: To the Seanchan, a male channeler should be put to death and a woman channeler must be leashed. Those that are leashed by the Suldam are called Damane. A Damane is little more than a weapon to those that command her Suldam and a pet to her Suldam. She has no choice of her own and many times even when freed, she wishes to return to her beloved master, her will being completely broken by the pain of the A'dam used to leash her. Seanchan Damane are raised from an early age into this position of slavery. Benefits: Damane receive a +2 bonus to weave checks for offensive weaves and reduce the weave cost by 2 for those weaves. Requirements: Female only. Seanchan only, or were found in the Westlands by the Seanchan before they were able to begin any other Tradition and thereby develop their channeling ability. Wise Ones: Some would argue that these Aiel women run their Clans more so than the Aiel Chieftans. The Wise Ones are both powerful and cunning. Not all Wise Ones can channel, but every Aiel woman that can channel is a part of the Wise One tradition. Some of the Wise Ones can Dream and those that can are very proficient at it. Benefits: Wise Ones gain the Latent Dreamer Feat for free. Requirements: Female only. Aiel only. Windfinder: The Ath'an Miere are more at home on the sea than on land. Their past is a mystery, but their destiny is tied to the Dragon as all other people. Their women that can channel are part of the Windfinder tradition. They find their homes on ships and use their abilities to alter the weather and wind and to guide and protect the ships they are on board. Benefits: Windfinders receive a +2 to all weave checks made within the Cloud Dancing Talent, and reduce the weave cost by 2 for those weaves. Requirements: Female only. Ath'an Miere only. Special: Must select Cloud Dancing as their Talent at level 1. Asha'man: Founded by the Dragon Reborn. "Make me weapons," he said, and that is what he received. Men from all over were recruited. For one reason or another they have choosen to follow the Dragon and harness the One Power as their weapon. Their training program is rigorous and unforgiving. Saidin has taught them that life is like walking a razor's edge. And they walk that razor everyday. Benefits: Asha'aman receive a +2 to weave checks made for offensive weaves, and reduce the weave cost by 2 for those weaves. Requirements: Male only. Wilder: More a lack of a Tradition than a Tradition. Wilders are those channelers that have slipped through the cracks and were never found to be trained. They have developed the ability to channel on their own. They are not mentored but instead train themselves, but to survive they have developed an emotional block. They can only channel when in a certain emotional state. Benefits: Wilders begin play with a Block. He must select a particular emotion and can only channel when in that emotional state. A Composure check DC 15 is required to attain this emotional state. The Block can later be over come by purchasing the Eliminate Block Feat. Wilders receive a +5 to Fortitude Saves for failed weave checks. Requirements: None, but they are vary rare in the Aiel and Atha'an Miere societies. Bonus Channeling Feats: A channeler may choose any feat that is classified as a Channeling Feat as a bonus feat for those levels indicated in the Table. Slow Aging: The ability to channel slows the aging process. Starting at 3rd level, divide your level by 2. The result is the number of years that must pass for your character to age one year. Bonus Armsman Feats: A Warrior Channeler may choose any feat that is classified as an armsman feat as a bonus feat for those levels indicated in the Table as long as he meets the requirements. Skilled Channeler (By: Blaine Britt) Hit Die: d6 Class Skills The skilled channeler's class skills (and the key ability for each skill) are Bluff (Cha), Composure (Wis), Concentration (Wis), Craft (Int), Diplomacy (Cha), Decifer Script (Int), Gather Information (Cha), Heal (Wis), Intimidate (Cha), Invert (Int), Jump (Str), Listen (Wis), Knowledge (Int), Profression (Wis), Ride (Dex), Search (Int), Sense Motive (Wis), Spot (Wis), Swim (Str), and Weavesight (Int). Skill Points at 1st Level: (6 + Int modifier) x 4. Skill Points at Each Additional Level: 6 + Int modifier. Table: The Skilled Channeler Level Base Attack Bonus Fort Save Ref Save Will Save Def Rep Special 1 +0 +0 +2 +1 +3 0 Channeling Tradition 2 +1 +0 +3 +2 +4 1 Bonus channeling feat 3 +2 +1 +3 +2 +4 1 Slow aging 4 +3 +1 +4 +2 +4 1 Skill Emphasis 5 +3 +1 +4 +3 +5 2 6 +4 +2 +5 +3 +5 2 Bonus channeling feat 7 +5 +2 +5 +4 +6 3 8 +6/+1 +2 +6 +4 +6 3 Skill Emphasis 9 +6/+1 +3 +6 +4 +6 3 10 +7/+2 +3 +7 +5 +7 4 Bonus channeling feat 11 +8/+3 +3 +7 +5 +7 4 12 +9/+4 +4 +8 +6 +8 5 Skill Emphasis 13 +9/+4 +4 +8 +6 +8 5 14 +10/+5 +4 +9 +6 +8 5 Bonus channeling feat 15 +11/+6/+1 +5 +9 +7 +9 6 16 +12/+7/+2 +5 +10 +7 +9 6 Skill Emphasis 17 +12/+7/+2 +5 +10 +8 +10 7 18 +13/+8/+3 +6 +11 +8 +10 7 Bonus channeling feat 19 +14/+9/+4 +6 +11 +8 +10 7 20 +15/+10/+5 +6 +12 +9 +11 8 Skill Emphasis Class Features: All of the following are class features of the skilled channeler. Weapon and Armor Proficiency: The skilled channeler is proficient with all simple weapons. Skilled channelers are not proficient with any type of armor, nor with shields. The One Power: Channelers draw upon the Five Powers of the True Source to cast arcane weaves. Affinities: Your channeler begins play with an Affinity for one of the Five Powers (Air, Earth, Fire, Spirit, or Water). If your channeler is female choose your Affinity from among Air, Spirit, and Water. If your channeler is male choose your Affinity from among Earth, Fire, and Spirit. Your channeler can gain more Affinities with the Additional Affinity feat. Talents and Weaves: Your channeler begins play having one common Talent. That Talent Skill is a permanent class skill for him. A channeler can gain more Talents with the Additional Talent feat. He also begins play knowing 8 common weaves. As the game progresses, your channeler can learn new weaves through observation and training. See the Weavesight skill description for more information. Cross-Talent Weaves: A channeler may spend skill points in Talent skills that he doesn't have, but they are considered Cross-Class skills. Channeling Tradition: A channeler is usually a member of a channeling tradition. The Tradition teaches the channeler not only how to channel but also teachs him a value system. Channeling traditions vary by culture and gender. Each channeler begins play as part of a certain tradition. Aes Sedai: In Tar Valon, the White Tower houses the ancient tradition of the Aes Sedai. In times past, both men and women have been part of the tradition. Since the Breaking, it has only consisted of women. It has also developed into 7 Ajahs, each of which has a different focus. Besides being strong in the Power, they have politic power as well. Kings and Queens show respect to the Aes Sedai, if only in public. Benefits: Aes Sedai gain a +4 to their Weavesight checks. Requirements: Female only. Damane: To the Seanchan, a male channeler should be put to death and a woman channeler must be leashed. Those that are leashed by the Suldam are called Damane. A Damane is little more than a weapon to those that command her Suldam and a pet to her Suldam. She has no choice of her own and many times even when freed, she wishes to return to her beloved master, her will being completely broken by the pain of the A'dam used to leash her. Seanchan Damane are raised from an early age into this position of slavery. Benefits: Damane receive a +2 bonus to weave checks for offensive weaves and reduce the weave cost by 2 for those weaves. Requirements: Female only. Seanchan only, or were found in the Westlands by the Seanchan before they were able to begin any other Tradition and thereby develop their channeling ability. Wise Ones: Some would argue that these Aiel women run their Clans more so than the Aiel Chieftans. The Wise Ones are both powerful and cunning. Not all Wise Ones can channel, but every Aiel woman that can channel is a part of the Wise One tradition. Some of the Wise Ones can Dream and those that can are very proficient at it. Benefits: Wise Ones gain the Latent Dreamer Feat for free. Requirements: Female only. Aiel only. Windfinder: The Ath'an Miere are more at home on the sea than on land. Their past is a mystery, but their destiny is tied to the Dragon as all other people. Their women that can channel are part of the Windfinder tradition. They find their homes on ships and use their abilities to alter the weather and wind and to guide and protect the ships they are on board. Benefits: Windfinders receive a +2 to all weave checks made within the Cloud Dancing Talent, and reduce the weave cost by 2 for those weaves. Requirements: Female only. Ath'an Miere only. Special: Must select Cloud Dancing as their Talent at level 1. Asha'man: Founded by the Dragon Reborn. "Make me weapons," he said, and that is what he received. Men from all over were recruited. For one reason or another they have choosen to follow the Dragon and harness the One Power as their weapon. Their training program is rigorous and unforgiving. Saidin has taught them that life is like walking a razor's edge. And they walk that razor everyday. Benefits: Asha'aman receive a +2 to weave checks made for offensive weaves, and reduce the weave cost by 2 for those weaves. Requirements: Male only. Wilder: More a lack of a Tradition than a Tradition. Wilders are those channelers that have slipped through the cracks and were never found to be trained. They have developed the ability to channel on their own. They are not mentored but instead train themselves, but to survive they have developed an emotional block. They can only channel when in a certain emotional state. Benefits: Wilders begin play with a Block. He must select a particular emotion and can only channel when in that emotional state. A Composure check DC 15 is required to attain this emotional state. The Block can later be over come by purchasing the Eliminate Block Feat. Wilders receive a +5 to Fortitude Saves for failed weave checks. Requirements: None, but they are vary rare in the Aiel and Atha'an Miere societies. Bonus Channeling Feats: A channeler may choose any feat that is classified as a Channeling Feat as a bonus feat for those levels indicated in the Table. Slow Aging: The ability to channel slows the aging process. Starting at 3rd level, divide your level by 2. The result is the number of years that must pass for your character to age one year. Skill Emphasis: A Skilled Channeler receives Skill Emphasis as a bonus feat for those levels indicated in the Table. Power Channeler (By: Blaine Britt) Hit Die: d6 Class Skills The power channeler's class skills (and the key ability for each skill) are Composure (Wis), Concentration (Wis), Craft (Int), Intimidate (Cha), Invert (Int), Knowledge (arcana), Profession (Wis), and Weavesight (Int). Skill Points at 1st Level: (8 + Int modifier) x 4. Skill Points at Each Additional Level: 8 + Int modifier. Table: The Power Channeler Level Base Attack Bonus Fort Save Ref Save Will Save Def Rep Special 1 +1 +2 +1 +2 +2 1 Channeling Tradition 2 +2 +3 +2 +3 +2 1 Bonus channeling feat 3 +3 +3 +2 +3 +3 2 Slow aging 4 +4 +4 +2 +4 +3 2 Bonus channeling feat 5 +5 +4 +3 +4 +3 3 6 +6/+1 +5 +3 +5 +4 3 Bonus channeling feat 7 +7/+2 +5 +4 +5 +4 4 8 +8/+3 +6 +4 +6 +4 4 Bonus channeling feat 9 +9/+4 +6 +4 +6 +5 5 10 +10/+5 +7 +5 +7 +5 5 Bonus channeling feat 11 +11/+6/+1 +7 +5 +7 +5 6 12 +12/+7/+2 +8 +6 +8 +6 6 Bonus channeling feat 13 +13/+8/+3 +8 +6 +8 +6 7 14 +14/+9/+4 +9 +6 +9 +6 7 Bonus channeling feat 15 +15/+10/+5 +9 +7 +9 +7 8 16 +16/+11/+6/+1 +10 +7 +10 +7 8 Bonus channeling feat 17 +17/+12/+7/+2 +10 +8 +10 +7 9 18 +18/+13/+8/+3 +11 +8 +11 +8 9 Bonus channeling feat 19 +19/+14/+9/+4 +11 +8 +11 +8 10 20 +20/+15/+10/+5 +12 +9 +12 +8 10 Bonus channeling feat Class Features: All of the following are class features of the Power channeler. Weapon and Armor Proficiency: The power channeler is proficient with the club and dagger. Power channelers are not proficient with any type of armor, nor with shields. The One Power: Channelers draw upon the Five Powers of the True Source to cast arcane weaves. Affinities: Your channeler begins play with an Affinity for one of the Five Powers (Air, Earth, Fire, Spirit, or Water). If your channeler is female choose your Affinity from among Air, Spirit, and Water. If your channeler is male choose your Affinity from among Earth, Fire, and Spirit. Your channeler can gain more Affinities with the Additional Affinity feat. Talents and Weaves: Your channeler begins play having one common Talent. That Talent Skill is a permanent class skill for him. A channeler can gain more Talents with the Additional Talent feat. He also begins play knowing 8 common weaves. As the game progresses, your channeler can learn new weaves through observation and training. See the Weavesight skill description for more information. Cross-Talent Weaves: A channeler may spend skill points in Talent skills that he doesn't have, but they are considered Cross-Class skills. Channeling Tradition: A channeler is usually a member of a channeling tradition. The Tradition teaches the channeler not only how to channel but also teachs him a value system. Channeling traditions vary by culture and gender. Each channeler begins play as part of a certain tradition. Aes Sedai: In Tar Valon, the White Tower houses the ancient tradition of the Aes Sedai. In times past, both men and women have been part of the tradition. Since the Breaking, it has only consisted of women. It has also developed into 7 Ajahs, each of which has a different focus. Besides being strong in the Power, they have politic power as well. Kings and Queens show respect to the Aes Sedai, if only in public. Benefits: Aes Sedai gain a +4 to their Weavesight checks. Requirements: Female only. Damane: To the Seanchan, a male channeler should be put to death and a woman channeler must be leashed. Those that are leashed by the Suldam are called Damane. A Damane is little more than a weapon to those that command her Suldam and a pet to her Suldam. She has no choice of her own and many times even when freed, she wishes to return to her beloved master, her will being completely broken by the pain of the A'dam used to leash her. Seanchan Damane are raised from an early age into this position of slavery. Benefits: Damane receive a +2 bonus to weave checks for offensive weaves and reduce the weave cost by 2 for those weaves. Requirements: Female only. Seanchan only, or were found in the Westlands by the Seanchan before they were able to begin any other Tradition and thereby develop their channeling ability. Wise Ones: Some would argue that these Aiel women run their Clans more so than the Aiel Chieftans. The Wise Ones are both powerful and cunning. Not all Wise Ones can channel, but every Aiel woman that can channel is a part of the Wise One tradition. Some of the Wise Ones can Dream and those that can are very proficient at it. Benefits: Wise Ones gain the Latent Dreamer Feat for free. Requirements: Female only. Aiel only. Windfinder: The Ath'an Miere are more at home on the sea than on land. Their past is a mystery, but their destiny is tied to the Dragon as all other people. Their women that can channel are part of the Windfinder tradition. They find their homes on ships and use their abilities to alter the weather and wind and to guide and protect the ships they are on board. Benefits: Windfinders receive a +2 to all weave checks made within the Cloud Dancing Talent, and reduce the weave cost by 2 for those weaves. Requirements: Female only. Ath'an Miere only. Special: Must select Cloud Dancing as their Talent at level 1. Asha'man: Founded by the Dragon Reborn. "Make me weapons," he said, and that is what he received. Men from all over were recruited. For one reason or another they have choosen to follow the Dragon and harness the One Power as their weapon. Their training program is rigorous and unforgiving. Saidin has taught them that life is like walking a razor's edge. And they walk that razor everyday. Benefits: Asha'aman receive a +2 to weave checks made for offensive weaves, and reduce the weave cost by 2 for those weaves. Requirements: Male only. Wilder: More a lack of a Tradition than a Tradition. Wilders are those channelers that have slipped through the cracks and were never found to be trained. They have developed the ability to channel on their own. They are not mentored but instead train themselves, but to survive they have developed an emotional block. They can only channel when in a certain emotional state. Benefits: Wilders begin play with a Block. He must select a particular emotion and can only channel when in that emotional state. A Composure check DC 15 is required to attain this emotional state. The Block can later be over come by purchasing the Eliminate Block Feat. Wilders receive a +5 to Fortitude Saves for failed weave checks. Requirements: None, but they are vary rare in the Aiel and Atha'an Miere societies. Bonus Channeling Feats: A channeler may choose any feat that is classified as a Channeling Feat as a bonus feat for those levels indicated in the Table. Slow Aging: The ability to channel slows the aging process. Starting at 3rd level, divide your level by 2. The result is the number of years that must pass for your character to age one year. This post has been edited by Sharn Penndroen on Jun 22 2004, 04:04 AM -------------------- I like swords. |
Darius Earthbinder |
Posted: Jun 20 2004, 12:01
PM
|
![]() Learned Master ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 35 Member No.: 146 Joined: 15-May 04 ![]() |
i like it but by having each Weave as a skill you
make it very hard to be good in a few weaves. would it not be better to
have either Affinities as as skills eg Fire,Earth where you roll your
lowest appropriate talent for the skill check, or the Talents as skills
where your roll the appropriate talent as the weave check? i also like the channelling classes they seem to better represent the channellers from the books, but would it not be better to make Asha'man only able to take the Warrior chaneller class, then allow them to multiclass into one of the others later on? just ideas all in all i like it better than any other system i've seen, but all do have their pro's This post has been edited by Darius Earthbinder on Jun 20 2004, 12:04 PM |
Sharn Penndroen |
Posted: Jun 20 2004, 01:58
PM
|
![]() Lemming Extraordinare ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 248 Member No.: 15 Joined: 15-January 04 ![]() |
I had thought of the fact that you are going to be
limited by the number of skill points that you have to throw around. There
are two solutions to this that I've thought of. 1) First off, some of the Weaves have lower DCs than other and you are eventually going to stop putting points in those weaves, so that in it self does something to aid the problem. 2) Second, I had thought of combining some of the weaves under a single skill. Especially a lot of the Elementalism weaves. Some of the wording I've used is a bit confusing because I've left it open for that. For instance, Harden Air and Arms of Air could belong to the same skill. The two weaves have to be learned separtely, but the same skill is used for both. Another example would be Move Water and Current. I had thought that it would be good to get most Talent to average between 4 - 7 skills each. Also it would be helpful to try to place new weaves (from UtDB, AoI, and whatever else) under a Weave Skill that is similar to it. Does all that make since. As far as Asha'aman go, sure you will definitely have more of them go as Warrior Channelers, but I could also see those that are more like Taim go the Power Channeler route. Taim despises mundane weapons and I'm sure that other Asha'aman have picked up on that too. I'd rather not require them to take a certain class. I think that even among the Asha'aman you will have some diversity. With the same reasoning, I could argue that most Aes Sedai would go the Skilled Channeler route, given their political involvement and tendancy to be more bookish. I think that if you are going by most characters in the books, the least common channeler would be a Power Channeler. I would think that the Asha'aman and Windfinders would turn out the most of those, but I'd rather leave the classes open to all traditions. As far as multiclassing goes, I'd rather leave it restricted to multiclassing for the time being... although I can see some reasoning in changing, but special consideration would have to be made that they couldn't choose a new tradition (and get the abilities from it) when they select a new class. -------------------- I like swords. |
Zarozynia |
Posted: Jun 20 2004, 03:15
PM
|
![]() Seer of Darkness ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 208 Member No.: 131 Joined: 10-April 04 ![]() |
I like the idea a lot, and the starwars system seems
to be better balanced than the wheel of time. But I definately do not like
the seperate skills for each weave. I know what you're trying at with the
force skills, but there are way more weaves than there are force skills,
even if you are grouping certain weaves together. I think that it should
be talent skills, that seems to reflect the starwars game better. Maybe
the elementalism skill should be broke up into fire elemental, water
elemental, etc. but that is the only one that I think that you should do
this for. (Because somebody that is really good at manipulating fire
weaves might not know anything about how to deal with air or water, for
instance. As far as the new classes go, how does this relate to the initiate/wilder idea that we have in the game right now? Because that does pretty accurately reflect the ideas in the book of some people being taught and some being a natural. -------------------- Legends of Darkness Are Not Always Myths - An Ongoing
experiment in writing/illustration/mythology Photographia Temple of the Goat - a philisophical weblog Diynen'd'ma'purvene - A Wheel of Time resource with backgrounds, feats, house rules and a vit/wound point system |
Entropic_existence |
Posted: Jun 20 2004, 04:10
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Breaker-of-horses-and-men ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 125 Member No.: 22 Joined: 15-January 04 ![]() |
I really like this myself. I understand your idea on
the traditions having access to all the Channeling Classes, although I
don't think the Aes Sedai or Wise Ones should be able to take the Warrior
Channeler since they are both forbidden from combat in nearly all cases,
and at the least couldn't use weapons like an armsman for the most part.
But I think there are always exceptions and should be left as is, as
always to the DM's discretion. Like others mentioned there may be skill point problems, although didn't you say that Players begin with knowledge of all common weaves in a Talent when they take that Talent? Maybe I misread it but that would help alot. Grouping weaves that are almost identical and just giving different examples of DC's and Point costs (arms of Air and Harden Air for example) should suffice. I think if you get into skills for affinities you start making a really complex system. If you do it for Talents it gives you too few. I think the ideas you already had are good to work from, perhaps upping the channeler classes skill points slightly would work as well. -------------------- What is dead can never
die. |
MagusRogue |
Posted: Jun 21 2004, 02:37
AM
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![]() Village fool. Paid well. ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 723 Member No.: 26 Joined: 16-January 04 ![]() |
this is pretty close to my weave skill system. Though
i upped the damage to 3 x slot level (0th level weaves do 1 hp), in
subdual damage. not too shabby. you forgot one tradition though: damane.
-------------------- Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaand this rant's
done. Magus the Extreme. Your wonderfully-ghoulish partner GM of Patterns of the Weave. Be fearful, indeed. |
Sharn Penndroen |
Posted: Jun 21 2004, 03:58
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![]() Lemming Extraordinare ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 248 Member No.: 15 Joined: 15-January 04 ![]() |
Zarozynia, I don't really feal that the current
classes of Wilder and Initiate are a proper reflection of a sparker
(someone that is going to learn no matter what) and someone that must be
taught. I'm not the only one that feels as such. A sparker can just as
easily been found early on and taught and be an initiate. In other words,
all wilders are sparkers, but not all sparkers are wilders. Others (namely
Drothgery for one) have taken steps to remove the Wilder as a class. I've
included it as a "Tradition," althought it is really a lack of a Tradition
and given certain game effects of being a wilder. I personally feel this
is more accurate than having a separate class for them. Opinions may vary.
As far as having Skills for each Talent instead of each weave, I don't
think that would be enough. The weaves are still so varied. I really think
that if they could be grouped enough to get 4-7 Weave Skills per Talent,
that it would be playable. That is of course unsubstantiated since I've
neither grouped them nor play tested it yet. You are right though, it
would be a lot of skills, but then again most channelers are good only in
certain areas in weak in others. Even the big guns like Nynaeve and
Rand. Entropic Existence, Aes Sedai aren't forbidden to do combat. They are forbidden to use the One Power as a Weapon except as a last resort in defense of herself or her Warder or against Shadowspawn. If that is the last resort what is the first. Nothing forbids the use of a sword... A minor point and we don't necessarily see Verin running around with a sword. That is what Warders are for, but it would still be possible for an Aes Sedai (Green Ajah) to go that route. Wise Ones a little more difficult because no Aiel would ever raise a hand to them, but who knows. I really don't think that it is necessary to make a hard line rule prohibiting certain traditions from certain classes. I think that the roleplaying will take care of that in most cases. It simply would not be advantageous to play an Aes Sedai in the White Tower that has sacrificed channeling ability or mundane skills, for use of weapons and melee / ranged combat. Most players wouldn't do it unless they had a creative background to support it. The point about the Talents and knowing the Common Weaves. That is true only for the first level Talent that you choose. This represents those Weaves that you have learned before the "game started." You may learn a weave that you do not have the Talent in by observing it ala Weavesight and make check in it at that point but you may not put ranks in it until after you have the Talent. Later you may take a new Talent, but do not automatically know those weaves unless you have learned them (either observation or figuring them out as a wilder). Hope that clears up any misunderstanding. Magus Rogue, I don't think that the damane tradition is playable for PCs, and that is why I didn't include it, but I suppose that I should include it for NPCs at least. I'll try to remember to add that. Thanks for all the comments thus far. -------------------- I like swords. |
Zinuk |
Posted: Jun 21 2004, 06:27
AM
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![]() Newbie ![]() Group: Members Posts: 3 Member No.: 166 Joined: 21-June 04 ![]() |
Another way of handling things would be to lower the
cost of weave skills in skill points rather than grouping weaves together
under a given skill. Weave skills cost "weave skill points" and you can exchange a (normal) skill point for, say 3 "weave skill points" (maybe more, maybe less; but there is about 3 times mores weaves than there are force skills; the right number would need playtesting though). This is an idea I just had. Hope it helps. |
Aleshandre |
Posted: Jun 21 2004, 02:09
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![]() Elder Scholar ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Moderators Posts: 138 Member No.: 18 Joined: 15-January 04 ![]() |
A lot of the elements that you use, I used in my
skill based system that I posted here. I think we all need to collaborate
on this system. That will give us a much better overall system. I'll cut
and paste my stuff into this thread, so we can compare and work together
on it. edit: 3 new skills: Power (con); Measures the amount of raw power that a person can use unaided. For men, this represents Saidin, for women Saidar. Fleuency (int); Measures the technical skill of the channeler. This represents the ability to perform intricate or otherwise complex (though not necessarilly powerful) weaves. Intensity (wis); Measures the ability to channel large quantities of the power. This represents the ability to use high powered (though not necessarilly complex) weaves. note: This skill does not effect the weave level in any way, but does affect the save DC for weaves that allow saves. Melding (wis); Measures the skill at melding the flows of both halves of the One Power. Only used when the channeler is linked with a person who wields the opposite half of the Power. Alternate rule for use with a 7th stat OP system: The Power skill is dropped. The Intensity skill uses the [power ability] as the associated ability. New effect for affinities: Affinities grant a +1 misc. modifier to skill checks for the One Power for each affinity that the character has. How this affects the mechanics (the way I intend it): -Each weave needs to be adjusted to indicate which skill it is related to. -Only members of a Channeling Tradition may take ranks in Fleuency or Intensity. -Weaves made outside of the character's Talents must be made with the Power skill (basically the catch-all skill). -If a channeler doesn't have the skill that a weave is associated with, the Power skill is used. -Critical failure is a possible consequence of weaves cast with the Power skill. -Overchanneling rolls use the Power skill (this is only rolls to determine success, not fort saves for failure). -Angreal and Sa'angreal now give their bonus to the skill roll for channelling. -Intensity based weaves that have a related save DC is increased by 1/2 times the character's ranks in intensity (rounded down). -Each weave costs an amount of subdual HP equal to casting level. 0 level weaves cost 1/2 point per weave. Overchannelling costs casting level +1. -Initiates get 7 skill points per level, gain Power and may have either Intensity or Fluency as class skills (based on Tradition; Windfinders and Suldam/Damane should take intensity, Wise Ones and Aes Sedai should take Fluency, Asha'man may take either). The other skill is a cross class skill. -Wilders get 6 Skill points per level and gain Power as a class skill. Intensity and Fluency are cross class skills for Wilders. -Only characters who are able to channel may take ranks in the channeling skills. -Using a 7th stat system, all untrained skill checks use the [power ability] for untrained checks -------------------- |
MagusRogue |
Posted: Jun 21 2004, 02:20
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![]() Village fool. Paid well. ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 723 Member No.: 26 Joined: 16-January 04 ![]() |
i think damane are perfectly-viable pc's, but only
escaped damanes. Or, if your pc is picked up by a damane and trained, then
the other pc's free her, then she easily qualifies for the damane
stuff. As for tradition benefits, i'm going with something similar in my d20 modern Initiated class. however, i would think Asha'man get something else. I would say Martial Weapons Proficiency (any sword) or Weapon Focus (any sword) as their benefit. Damane should be able to inflict more damage than other traditions (maybe... add half their level to the damage of all offensive weaves? or make them to an additional die of damage?). Dunno yet... good work though. -------------------- Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaand this rant's
done. Magus the Extreme. Your wonderfully-ghoulish partner GM of Patterns of the Weave. Be fearful, indeed. |
Aleshandre |
Posted: Jun 21 2004, 02:48
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![]() Elder Scholar ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Moderators Posts: 138 Member No.: 18 Joined: 15-January 04 ![]() |
Okay, I've been reading over the systems and here is
what I am begining to think: Having 3-4 basic skills that cover all of the related effects should be enough, since skill points aren't really is great supply, and since having too many would be unbalancing and too few would be crippling. The channeling classes that you have are balanced, but the Warrior channeler has too few skill points per level to use with each weave being another skill. I think that having a list of weaves that are known and basing them on the basic skills would be better, just to simplify things alittle. I like the DCs. Since most channelers will never have more than 3 affinities, I think that having the affinities giving a bonus to the skill checks for the weaves would be better. Thats all I have for now. -------------------- |
Talan |
Posted: Jun 21 2004, 07:06
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Learned Master ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 24 Member No.: 40 Joined: 20-January 04 ![]() |
It looks good, and it is nice to finally see some
attempts at a skill-based Channeling System (instead of hints and
suggestions). Nice job. I have some comments however. Personally I don't like to have "normal" skills work the same as Channeling skills. If I were a Channeler I would be tempted to neglect the normal skills, since taking ranks in Ride for example, would make me a lousier Channeler. I know thats propably unavoidable with a Skill-based Chan. System ????? I think you have waaayyyy too many different skills, and this limits the systems flexibility. If Channelers used Aleshandre's skills or each Talent was a skill it would be much more flexible - which I think is the main difference between Channeling and normal D&D spells. You could simply limit the amount of Skill points, and the end result in ranks would be the same. One of the cool things about the OP is the way Channelers in the books can learn new weaves. How would you mirror the ability to instantly learn a weave and use it, if you have to use skill points in each weave ???? A Talent measures a Channelers ability to use certain kinds of related weaves (which might fit with the idea that each Talent is a different skill ?). Elementalism is not really a Talent (it doesn't exist in Jordans books), but something Wizards created to make a group for all the Elemental spells. I have always felt that Elementalism should be common weaves, since everybody seems able to learn these kind of weaves in the books. Perhaps the Affinities could represent a Channelers skill with these weaves (thus having Fire Affinity makes you better at creating Fire weaves !). Talan |
Sharn Penndroen |
Posted: Jun 21 2004, 07:38
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![]() Lemming Extraordinare ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 248 Member No.: 15 Joined: 15-January 04 ![]() |
Aleshandre, I want to Chat with you and work out
something on the Skills. I would like to get about 8 skills or so and
place all the weaves under one of those. I think that would be fine...
Maybe. I would like to expand on what you've done to get
that. Talen, as far as learning a new weave instantly, I have accounted for that. If you notice I've said that you can make untrained skill checks in weaves that you have learned. You can then put skill points in it when you go up a level to represent you haven't practiced this and gotten better at it. The way I see it, if two weaves are common enough to be under the same skill (after we combine weaves under the same skill) then once you learn it, you've already got ranks in it and are already pretty good at it. You could reason that they are in common and you can use what you know about one to effect the other.) This is the way I envision a system that puts a lot of the weaves under about 8 Skills. Under a Certain skill you have several Weaves. Of those weaves, they will come from various Talents. Unless you have a Talent in that Weave, then even when you learn it, you may only make untrained skill checks (no ranks applied, only ability modifier). This is to represent Cross-Talent Weaves. Later if you gain that Talent then you may apply the Ranks you have in that Skill to the checks. I toyed with the idea of having Affinities working this way: - For every Affinity you have of a Weave you get a +1 to your Weave Check and a -1 to the Weave Cost. - For every Affinity you do not have of a Weave you get a -1 to your Weave Check and a +1 to the Weave Cost. I decided against this because, if you have all 5 affinities then it is actually more easy for you to make weaves that are more complex (all 5 affinities) as opposed to those that are only 1 weave. That is why I decided to do it like I did. It seems that you were suggesting something like the above method, Aleshandre. I'm not sure if you realized the possible problems with such a system. Does this make since, or were you thinking of something else. I appreciate everyone's comments, this is truly helpful. -------------------- I like swords. |
Guest |
Posted: Jun 21 2004, 07:56
PM
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Unregistered ![]() |
I really think you should try to use Robert Jordans
terms, instead of inventing 8 skills with new names (if thats what you
meant). If you group weaves from different Talents you are, in a very
fundamental way, changing the few things we know about Channeling (as
described by RJ). You could 1) Use the Affinities as Skills or 2) use Talents as skills. Affinities and Talents (and Power) are what RJ uses to describe his Channelers and these terms invoke the feeling from the books - which is very important IMO (and propably the only good thing in Wizards system ![]() Talan |
Sharn Penndroen |
Posted: Jun 21 2004, 08:41
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![]() Lemming Extraordinare ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 248 Member No.: 15 Joined: 15-January 04 ![]() |
As always Talen, you make a very good
point. Okay, I think Affinities as skills are out because weaves use multiple affinities. So that means Talents. A good idea to use those, but here is my problem with that. There are just too few of them. I mean, if you start only with one Talent, then do you say that you can only put skills in that one Talent. You are for sure going to be maxed out in it... I had a thought, maybe for those Talents that you have you treat that Talent Skill as a Class skill. For all other Talents that skill is a cross-class skill? I don't know. Do you see the problem that I'm having with this. It just seems like there are too few Talents to do them as skills. Also as someone mentioned some of the Talents are made up by Wizards and never mentioned by RJ. Not that there is a problem with this, but I'm just saying if we do make something up, then we wouldn't be the first to do so. Umm... maybe I'm being to hastey to say that there are too few Talents to use them as Skills. Especially if you can spend skill points on Talents you don't have and count them as Cross Class Skills for purposes of max ranks and what not. *Thinks* I'll give it a shot and try to assign them Ability Scores to modify them and post it later to get some feed back. -------------------- I like swords. |
MagusRogue |
Posted: Jun 21 2004, 08:58
PM
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![]() Village fool. Paid well. ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 723 Member No.: 26 Joined: 16-January 04 ![]() |
hey i got an idea, Sharn. Make the five Affinities as
skills. Then, whenever you cast a weave, you choose the affinity skill you
want to use. if the weave calls for more than one affinity, use the
highest one. If the other affinities are 5 ranks or better, then each one
with more than 4 ranks grants a +2 circumstance bonus on the affinity
check. -------------------- Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaand this rant's
done. Magus the Extreme. Your wonderfully-ghoulish partner GM of Patterns of the Weave. Be fearful, indeed. |
Sharn Penndroen |
Posted: Jun 21 2004, 10:21
PM
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![]() Lemming Extraordinare ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 248 Member No.: 15 Joined: 15-January 04 ![]() |
Magus, this presents the same problem as the other
suggestion with Affinities that Aleshandre made. A complex weave that
requires all 5 affinities becomes easier to make than a simple one with
only one affiniity. Example of what you have suggested: Weave A Affinity: Air, Earth, Fire, Spirit, Water DC: 10 Weave B Affinity: Fire DC: 10 Channeler has all atleast 5 ranks in all 5 affinities. Casting Weave A, he receives a +8 bonus from the other 4 affinities to his Fire check. Effectively lowering the DC to 2 Casting Weave B, he receives no bonus to his Fire check. The DC remains 10. With the current system and with the system of Affinities that I've presented, Weave a would be the more difficult compared to Weave B, because the channeler would be able to cast Weave B at a DC sooner. Follow me? -------------------- I like swords. |
Entropic_existence |
Posted: Jun 21 2004, 10:40
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Breaker-of-horses-and-men ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 125 Member No.: 22 Joined: 15-January 04 ![]() |
Exactly, within the D20 system and it's skills it
would not work terribly well, IMO, to use Affinities as the skills. (BTW
did Jordan ever use the word Affinities other than saying someone had an
affinity for Air/Fire/Water/Spirit?) In my opinion taking weaves that seem
closely related and making working "skill" groups of weaves would probably
work best. You don't necessarily need to call it anything other than say
Weave Group: Blah, because that sort of thing isn't exactly "In character"
in my opinion. All one would need to do of course is determine what weaves
go where....of course Talents already group pretty closely related weaves ![]() -------------------- What is dead can never
die. |
MagusRogue |
Posted: Jun 22 2004, 01:35
AM
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![]() Village fool. Paid well. ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 723 Member No.: 26 Joined: 16-January 04 ![]() |
honestly, i don't like the way Affinites work so far.
in the book, there never really was evidence of having multiple
affinities, or anyone having a single affinity at all. just that women are
more strongly powered in Water and Air, while men are better with Fire and
Earth. -------------------- Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaand this rant's
done. Magus the Extreme. Your wonderfully-ghoulish partner GM of Patterns of the Weave. Be fearful, indeed. |
Sharn Penndroen |
Posted: Jun 22 2004, 03:53
AM
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![]() Lemming Extraordinare ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 248 Member No.: 15 Joined: 15-January 04 ![]() |
Revised original post.
-------------------- I like swords. |
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