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MagusRogue |
Posted: Feb 16 2004, 04:00
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![]() Village fool. Paid well. ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 703 Member No.: 26 Joined: 16-January 04 ![]() |
"In the Mountains of Mist, alone in the emptied
city of Manetheren, Eldrene felt Aemon die, and her heart died with him.
And where her heart had been was left only a thirst for vengeance,
vengeance for her love, vengeance for her people and her land. Driven by
grief she reached out to the True Source, and hurled the One Power at the
Trolloc army. And there the Drealdoards died wherever they stood, whether
in their secret councils or exhorting their soldiers. In the passing of a
breath the Dreadlords and the generals of the Dark One's host burst into
flame. Fire consumed their bodies, and terror consumed their
just-victorious army. ... But the price was high for Manetheren. Eldrene had drawn to herself more of the One Power than any human could ever hope to wield unaided. As the enemy generals died, so did she, and the fires that consumed the empty city of Manetheren, even the stones of it, down to the living rock of the mountains. Yet the people have been saved." There may come a time when a channeler decides to forfeit his or her life in the name of the Light and all that is good. Upon uttering their final curses, they open themselves to the One Power, indeed, to the True Source itself, and cry their anguish. Becoming a living conduit of the One Power, they unleash energies that can decimate entire armies. However, the price is indeed high for this sacrifice, and the channeler becomes consumed by the True Source, until nothing is left. But some still willingly take this death, to strike back at those who have angered them so. To issue a Final Strike, a channeler must first succeed on a Concentration check, DC 35. The DM may add a bonus ranging from +2 to +10, depending on the circumstance. A PC wishing to strike down a myrddraal that's overly annoying the party might at best recieve a +4. Witnessing the death of every person you ever once loved would easily warrent a +8, if not a full +10. Failure on this roll is treated as an overchanneling failure, with a Fortitude save DC of 40. If successful, the character has become a living conduit of the True Source. They immediately can cast one final weave at the highest slot allowed by their class, regardless of Channeling Ability scores or if it's been spent already. Angreal use adds to this as normal. Furthermore, they may add twice their character level to this weave. They may apply as any metaweave feats they wish to this weave, even if they do not have that feat, so long as it's within their combined weave level. Lastly, the character is considered to have all affinities for that weave. Upon casting this final weave, the True Source literally burns the character from within, leaving nothing behind. Indeed, the True Source itself leaks out to the surrounding area, warping it and making it a grave of the martyred channeler, known as a grave-home. The size of the grave-home is proportional to the channeler. A small pond may be the grave-home of an Accepted who lost her family to a trolloc warband, while an entire massive lake may be created for an epic Asha'man. Those who enter this area may feel the lingering traces of the One Power, especially if they have the Sense Residue feat. Regardless, the remorse colors the area, even while at the same time granting it a final fulfillment and peace. This rule should only be used as a last resort, as not only will it destroy the character utterly, the backlash of One Power may destroy the entire party. However, it is very fitting for one final scene of the player, recreating the fall of Eldrene, or Lews Therin's anguish of remorse and hatred of himself. Whatcha think guys? -------------------- Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaand this rant's
done. Magus the Extreme. Your wonderfully-ghoulish partner GM of Patterns of the Weave. Be fearful, indeed. |
MagusRogue |
Posted: Feb 17 2004, 04:30
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![]() Village fool. Paid well. ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 703 Member No.: 26 Joined: 16-January 04 ![]() |
no bites? *pout*
-------------------- Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaand this rant's
done. Magus the Extreme. Your wonderfully-ghoulish partner GM of Patterns of the Weave. Be fearful, indeed. |
Sharn Penndroen |
Posted: Feb 17 2004, 05:27
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![]() Lemming Extraordinare ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 239 Member No.: 15 Joined: 15-January 04 ![]() |
I'm kind of confused a little... you never list
damage done here by doing this. I'm assuming that you intend for someone
to use a high level weave that they know, but I don't think that fits. You
see you aren't really weaving anything just channeling pure Saidin/Saidar.
Plus, not every channeler has and "attack" weave. What if you did a
Healing spell with this? I don't see how channeling untamed Saidin into
someone is going to Heal them. More likely to rip their guts out if you
tried to. Or what if you did Mist of Mirrors with this... How is that
going to hurt anyone... I think that you need to have it deal a certain amount of damage where the damage and area area are dependent upon the weave level. You know what I mean, Vern? -------------------- I like swords. |
Mantyluoto |
Posted: Feb 17 2004, 06:27
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![]() New Monster: Hairy Dragon ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 446 Member No.: 17 Joined: 15-January 04 ![]() |
My take on it is that you would expend your life
energies drawing in as much Saidin/Saidar as you could hold and using it
as pure Raw Power to kill whatever has caused the pain. Yes you'd die
casting it but so would they. to be honest i don't think you NEED to be worrying about damage levels because if my Initiate/Wilder or Aes Sedai has just done a Final Strike and was now dead there no way i'd want to sit there and work out damage. As a player i'd just want to know that i'd killed everything. Manty -------------------- For Those About To Rock, We Salute You |
MagusRogue |
Posted: Feb 17 2004, 01:28
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![]() Village fool. Paid well. ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 703 Member No.: 26 Joined: 16-January 04 ![]() |
Basically, Manty has it here. I should have added the
clause "This causes a random, but damaging effect. Base it either on a
weave you have and keep adding metaweaves, or make up some new effect,"
similar to what happens when you botch up an Unraveling check. Once you
succeed on the Concentration check, it really doesn't matter any more,
because just about anything you're pissed off at that's fairly near you is
gonna be toast. If you want hard and fast rules, i'd say it would do about.... if you don't wanna use a weave, i'd say pool up the weave levels. You can spend a weave level to do either 1d6 damage, or extend the targetable range of the weave half a mile, or target 2 people. -------------------- Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaand this rant's
done. Magus the Extreme. Your wonderfully-ghoulish partner GM of Patterns of the Weave. Be fearful, indeed. |
Sharn Penndroen |
Posted: Feb 18 2004, 01:17
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![]() Lemming Extraordinare ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 239 Member No.: 15 Joined: 15-January 04 ![]() |
Manty, I prefer to have an actual number for the
damage done. While you as a player only care that you killed everything, I
as a GM want to know if my insane villian that the party is after does
this. Do I just say, "Sorry, fellas, you are all dead. She did Final
Strike when you walked up."? I understand that players are not going
to do this often, but baddies are more expendable and more likely to be
insane or suicidal. You see why I want a number of damage to give? Heroes
(or powerful folks) can manage to survive things that would kill most
others. Ishy survives Lews Therin's Final Strike. Birgitte, Aviendha, and
Elayne survive Unraveling a weave. I wouldn't feel right introducing a
mechanic that just kills my party because their opponent is willing to
kill themselves. -------------------- I like swords. |
Targul |
Posted: Feb 18 2004, 02:40
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![]() Aran'shadar ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 148 Member No.: 69 Joined: 29-January 04 ![]() |
I think that Magus is meaning for it to come with a
significant event. Even most insane people I know of have some sense of
self preservation. Looking at the two main examples of this happening,
Lews Therin and Eldrene, it took an extreme emotional state and
significant events leading up to that. Lews Therin had just found out that
he was personally responsible for not only the deaths of everyone he had
ever loved and cared for but that he had also caused the eventual downfall
of every male channeler in the world due to madness. Eldrene lost her
husband/warder personally that is bad let alone adding the bond on top of
that, and all of her people were being exterminated due to the betrayal of
those that her people had lent aid to numerous times before. I wouldn't let my PCs do something like this without extreme circumstance and story reason, let alone my NPCs. I don't know about you but how many self involved, self promoting, bad guys do you actually think would ever get to that point let alone sacrifice themselves. There is no benefit for them. Screw the cause, I really doubt that is what most villians are about. It's more like ME, ME,ME. Just my 2 silver pennies -------------------- Wait, if I DID evil, and you guys here
ARE evil. Then shouldn't you be showering me with rewards and
concubines, etc.? This is Hell we're big on irony here. Then I'm sure you'll appreciate what is going to occur. I'm dead, so this is some egoscopic projection of myself? Correct, but I hardly see what... So without any fleshy meats to slow me down, how long do you REALLY think it'll take for me to usurp your entire kingdom? I have the entire legions of Hell at my command Enjoy it while you can, Skippy. -Black Mage in Hell (8-bit theater style) |
Kakita Aramoro |
Posted: Feb 18 2004, 03:29
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Elder Scholar ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 129 Member No.: 74 Joined: 1-February 04 ![]() |
I don't recall the exact mechanics, but in faerun
they have something called spelfire chaneling, or something like that,
it's a feat there, but I think that it would work here as a final strike
without the feat. though in that system I think its mostly a way to have a
damaging spell always available to wizards without having to prepare it,
like the cleric's spontaneus cure spells. |
Targul |
Posted: Feb 18 2004, 04:05
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![]() Aran'shadar ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 148 Member No.: 69 Joined: 29-January 04 ![]() |
You can store spellfire points equal to your
constitution score. These points may be expended to heal or more
importantly to do 1d6 (half fire, Half raw magic) damage per point
expended. I suppose that this could work. I suppose that if I had to assign damage it would be something like this but would expend all weaves all of which would be overchanneled as much as possible. Then count up the levels and do that many d6 to yourself and all the beings who were the cause of your anger and grief. -------------------- Wait, if I DID evil, and you guys here
ARE evil. Then shouldn't you be showering me with rewards and
concubines, etc.? This is Hell we're big on irony here. Then I'm sure you'll appreciate what is going to occur. I'm dead, so this is some egoscopic projection of myself? Correct, but I hardly see what... So without any fleshy meats to slow me down, how long do you REALLY think it'll take for me to usurp your entire kingdom? I have the entire legions of Hell at my command Enjoy it while you can, Skippy. -Black Mage in Hell (8-bit theater style) |
Sharn Penndroen |
Posted: Feb 18 2004, 03:43
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![]() Lemming Extraordinare ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 239 Member No.: 15 Joined: 15-January 04 ![]() |
Dude, how many people have you heard of in the news
that get ticked about something at work, go there kill like 10 people then
blow their brains out. Imagine if they could channel and do final strike.
What about al'Queda? Suicide Bombers. People might argue, but I consider
terrorist badguys and they fight for a "cause." I know that is RL and we're talking about a fantasy setting, but RJ has said that he imagines his world as both the past and future of our world. Picture this, a Forsaken finds a channeler and trains them, the whole time promising them Immortality and a chance to become a Chosen if they are obedient. Finally the Forsaken tells them they are to go to the White Tower and meet with the Amrylin Seat. There they will do this Final Strike thingy to kill her. In giving their life to advance the cause of the DO, the DO will bring the poor sap back into a new body and elevate them to the rank of Chosen. The person has been prepared for this moment their whole life, and he/she does it without question. Whether or not the Forsaken was lying is beside the point. My twisted GM mind can thinking of several other times that baddies would use this. I like the spellfire mechanic. I use it in FR. I'd probably allow 1d6 per weave level (the Overchanneling, buffed up weave level). -------------------- I like swords. |
MagusRogue |
Posted: Feb 18 2004, 03:47
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![]() Village fool. Paid well. ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 703 Member No.: 26 Joined: 16-January 04 ![]() |
true. Then again, how many of them would succeed on a DC 35 concentration check to do it, without the circumstance bonus? I wouldn't even really let it be all that big if it wasn't dramatic moment in gaming, though. anyone can burn themselves out and kill alot of people. not everyone can create Dragonmount at the same time. -------------------- Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaand this rant's
done. Magus the Extreme. Your wonderfully-ghoulish partner GM of Patterns of the Weave. Be fearful, indeed. | ||
MagusRogue |
Posted: Feb 18 2004, 03:50
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![]() Village fool. Paid well. ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 703 Member No.: 26 Joined: 16-January 04 ![]() |
also, note the spellfire method is pretty similar to
what i suggested. Get your highest weave back, add your levels to that,
and convert it to 1d6 per level to everything that hurt you. *G* you might
be able to do healing as well. anyone ever thought of doing a final strike
to heal all your allies, in exchange for your own life?
-------------------- Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaand this rant's
done. Magus the Extreme. Your wonderfully-ghoulish partner GM of Patterns of the Weave. Be fearful, indeed. |
Mantyluoto |
Posted: Feb 18 2004, 05:47
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![]() New Monster: Hairy Dragon ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 446 Member No.: 17 Joined: 15-January 04 ![]() |
Targul said
thats what i was getting at. It would be like the final battle scene of an epic movie and the channeller would sacrifice themselves for the greater good. Damage mechanics and concentration checks are not needed. If my player wanted to use Final Strike to save the world then he/she would do it knowing they had. They are not going to care if the listed damage is so many d6 or whatever. There Pc will be dead. My player spends hours thinking of little things about his characters, quirks and the like that before you know it they are like friends. if he had to use the Final Strike option then he would be gutted if it didn't kill those attacking him. And as for letting Npc's do it..... No chance. Since when do villians do heroic deeds. Self sacrifice whilst sometimes viewed as selfishness is often the only way to save something so important that you are literally prepared to die for it. Can you say that any of the Black Ajah or even the Forsaken would be prepared to do that? Manty -------------------- For Those About To Rock, We Salute You | ||
Blaeric Fen |
Posted: Feb 18 2004, 06:28
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![]() Honorary Court JeSter ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 267 Member No.: 71 Joined: 30-January 04 ![]() |
So would the damage taken be subdual because of the
noise impact, or physical because of the impact of the noise on the
surroundings? -------------------- If you've got nothing to live for, what's the point
of living? Dont be afraid of death, be afraid of an unlived life ; you dont have to live forever, you just have to live... |
Mantyluoto |
Posted: Feb 18 2004, 06:29
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![]() New Monster: Hairy Dragon ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 446 Member No.: 17 Joined: 15-January 04 ![]() |
i would think it would be of the kill, shread, rend,
splatter kind. -------------------- For Those About To Rock, We Salute You |
Blaeric Fen |
Posted: Feb 18 2004, 06:30
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![]() Honorary Court JeSter ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 267 Member No.: 71 Joined: 30-January 04 ![]() |
Sounds good to me... ![]() -------------------- If you've got nothing to live for, what's the point
of living? Dont be afraid of death, be afraid of an unlived life ; you dont have to live forever, you just have to live... |
Targul |
Posted: Feb 18 2004, 11:33
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![]() Aran'shadar ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 148 Member No.: 69 Joined: 29-January 04 ![]() |
Sharn makes a good point. There are always those who
have been trained and taught/led to that sort of end. I really think that
most people do have inherent self preservation. That doesn't mean that
there is a small amount that just don't give a fuck. I really doubt that a
guy who gets angry enough just working a McDonalds to go blow a bunch of
people away is going to have the discipline to master the One Power enough
to pull something like this off effectively though. I was mainly thinking of the Forsaken when I wrote earlier and the Black Ajah. I don't see any of these people having the nerve or the cajones to pull something like this off relying on the DO to bring them back though. Never thought of a brainwashed mofo though. I'm a United State Marine and any Marine will tell you that bootcamp is really just a regime of brainwashing. At least any one smart enought to realize it will. But that's why we are so dangerous. So kudos to Sharn for thing from a different angle. Game rules wise though I probably would only allow it in the circumstances I named above. I think it is more story and game appropriate. Semper Fi -------------------- Wait, if I DID evil, and you guys here
ARE evil. Then shouldn't you be showering me with rewards and
concubines, etc.? This is Hell we're big on irony here. Then I'm sure you'll appreciate what is going to occur. I'm dead, so this is some egoscopic projection of myself? Correct, but I hardly see what... So without any fleshy meats to slow me down, how long do you REALLY think it'll take for me to usurp your entire kingdom? I have the entire legions of Hell at my command Enjoy it while you can, Skippy. -Black Mage in Hell (8-bit theater style) |
Sharn Penndroen |
Posted: Feb 19 2004, 03:24
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![]() Lemming Extraordinare ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 239 Member No.: 15 Joined: 15-January 04 ![]() |
That's how I keep my players guessing. ![]() If I did allow this Final Strike mechanic (and I just might do so), rest assured that I will find a way for an enemy to use it. Probably not against the party, but imagine a big mountain coming up in the middle of Tear because some brainwashed sap killed a High Lord thinking that it was Rand al'Thor... **Evil Villian Laugh** ![]() ![]() ![]() -------------------- I like swords. | ||
MagusRogue |
Posted: Feb 19 2004, 03:46
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![]() Village fool. Paid well. ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 703 Member No.: 26 Joined: 16-January 04 ![]() |
sharn, you're almost as evil as Blaeric's ninjas....
*Shudder* -------------------- Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaand this rant's
done. Magus the Extreme. Your wonderfully-ghoulish partner GM of Patterns of the Weave. Be fearful, indeed. |
Targul |
Posted: Feb 19 2004, 05:16
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![]() Aran'shadar ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 148 Member No.: 69 Joined: 29-January 04 ![]() |
OOOOOhHH That is really evil.
-------------------- Wait, if I DID evil, and you guys here
ARE evil. Then shouldn't you be showering me with rewards and
concubines, etc.? This is Hell we're big on irony here. Then I'm sure you'll appreciate what is going to occur. I'm dead, so this is some egoscopic projection of myself? Correct, but I hardly see what... So without any fleshy meats to slow me down, how long do you REALLY think it'll take for me to usurp your entire kingdom? I have the entire legions of Hell at my command Enjoy it while you can, Skippy. -Black Mage in Hell (8-bit theater style) |
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