Author
|
Topic:
Cuendillar |
Whitewinds
Member Member # 124732
|
posted January 29, 2003 06:41 PM
Does anyone
have any sort of stats for this stuff? I'm personally inclined
to this:
Hardness 1,000, and hit points of 250/gram
(28.35 grams=1 avoirdupois ounce). When an attack *does*
exceed the hardness, the damage done is *added* to the
object's hit points, up to double the base hit points. After
that, further damage will weaken it normally. Also, cuendillar
is always assumed to make its saving throw.
Yes, the
values above are insane. But considering what it took just to
make the Seals fragile...
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JosephKell
Member Member # 99447
|
posted January 29, 2003 07:00 PM
... I want
Cuendillar Full Plate for my Armsman....
Would it grant a DR to the wearer? Or
increase the defense of the
item?
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Whitewinds
Member Member # 124732
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posted January 29, 2003 07:32 PM
quote:
Originally posted by JosephKell: ... I
want Cuendillar Full Plate for my Armsman....
Would it grant a DR to the wearer? Or
increase the defense of the item?
I'm not certain, but working by comparison to the
Power-wrought blades in WoT, and the special materials in
D&D, I'd be inclined to say that armour would have a
Defense bonus of probably +3 or +4. Mind you, there's a *lot*
of iron in a suit of armour, and it's in lots of pieces, so
making cuendillar armour is going to be a very expensive
proposition, assuming you can find a channeler both able and
willing to do so (good luck!)
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JosephKell
Member Member # 99447
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posted January 29, 2003 07:57 PM
what about
just a Breast Plate? that is just two
pieces....
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Eagle Prince
Member Member # 67693
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posted January 29, 2003 08:39 PM
Heartstone
armor, I'd probably do a +5 enhancement bonus w/ heavy
fortification (immune to criticals).
I would give it a
hardness of probably 40, and same hit points as steel, then
say all damage absorbed by the hardness gives it the same
number of temporary hit points for 24 hours or
something.
Probably not exactly how it would work by
the books, but that way probably wouldn't end up too well
mechanically.
-------------------- I am the
Immortal One hidden from the dawn, I am the Emperor-King after
day has gone.
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JosephKell
Member Member # 99447
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posted January 29, 2003 08:53 PM
Damage
Absorbing Breast Plate.... *Drool*
*Imagines balefire splashing off the armor!*
HA.. HA HA, HA HA HA HA! *Falls over and hits his head*
Ow...
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Caeln
Member Member # 124781
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posted January 30, 2003 01:07 AM
I would
stick to the novels here. If I recall anything at all,
Cuendillar should be indestructible, or at least very close
to.
Besides, making an armor out of it is quite
difficult, since making of Cuendillar is a lost ability (and
still is one even in the novels). A VERY lost
ability.
But if you would manage to make an armor out
of it, the statistics might be difficult to come by. If you
could cover your whole bodu with Cuendillar, you would be
impossible to wound (except for bruises, of course).
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Jak Shadow
Member Member # 39941
|
posted January 30, 2003 04:01 AM
quote:
Originally posted by Caeln: I would stick
to the novels here. If I recall anything at all, Cuendillar
should be indestructible, or at least very close
to.
Besides, making an armor out of it is quite
difficult, since making of Cuendillar is a lost ability (and
still is one even in the novels). A VERY lost
ability.
But if you would manage to make an armor out
of it, the statistics might be difficult to come by. If you
could cover your whole bodu with Cuendillar, you would be
impossible to wound (except for bruises, of
course).
*Chokes.*
*Manages to stay silent despite
himself.*
Gah!!!!! Erm, yeah, well...
So, the
Cuendillar is certainly indestructible, if you were fully
encased in armour made form the stuff nothing could damage
you, although something like a fall from a great height would
still kill you. The armour would be fine but you'd be jelly
inside of it =) Slashing and piercing weapons would be totally
uneffective against it, bludgeoning ones might be seen to do
subdual damage? Bruising and
suchlike...
-------------------- "I'm not feeling
very well, it must be the anthrax." ~ Saturday night Delta
Green, GenCon UK
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Xythlord
Member Member # 70903
|
posted January 30, 2003 05:34 AM
Easy
there....hold on, you can do it.
Ok, better. About the only thing I can think
of that would be the down side of having cuendillar armor is
that it would probably be worth the entire nation of Tear,
with a little change to spare. I'm not sure any level of
protection is worth having everyone seeing if you have
just donated to their personal retirement fund. It would be
like somehow making a bullet proof vest out of diamond
now-adays. Sure, you could probably deflect any bullet (just a
loose theory mind you, only for example)but gawd help you if
you go into any part of town that adventurers normally
frequent.
Also it would have to be made out of solid
peices (plate, breast plate, etc.) Obvously no chain shirt
![[Wink]](Wizards_Com Boards Cuendillar (1)_fichiers/wink.gif)
-------------------- Only two things are
infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure
about the former. Albert Einstein (1879 - 1955)
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Tam al'Moff
Member Member # 79189
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posted January 30, 2003 08:00 AM
Egwene did
the chain in the harbour of Tar Valon almost instantly and it
must have been many seperate pieces. IMHO it would be just as
easy to do a mail shirt as it would to do a breast
plate.
-------------------- If it aint broke don't
fix it.
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Lord Schpungus
Member Member # 111502
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posted January 30, 2003 08:55 AM
But doing
two cups at once fused them together. Also, what would be the
point of turning the iron chains across the harbor into
cuendillar if they don't fuse together? They'd still be able
to retract it as normal if it wasn't fused. That's the reason
they did it in the first place, was to block incoming ships by
placing an impassable barrier of solid cuendillar across the
harbor.
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Jak Shadow
Member Member # 39941
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posted January 30, 2003 08:57 AM
quote:
Originally posted by Tam al'Moff: [Cut for
*SPOILER*]. IMHO it would be just as easy to do a mail shirt
as it would to do a breast plate.
Um, dude, careful of *SPOLIERS* as don't forget CoT is
still very new and a lot of people wont have it yet. There's a
thread just below this one for discussions of the book which
specifies that it cotains spoilers. Any other posts in threads
about the new book should come with a spoiler warning to be
fair to those who haven't had a chance to read it yet. WH and
previous have been out more than long enough to not bother
doing that with of
course.
-------------------- "I'm not feeling
very well, it must be the anthrax." ~ Saturday night Delta
Green, GenCon UK
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Whitewinds
Member Member # 124732
|
posted January 30, 2003 10:54 AM
quote:
Originally posted by Jak Shadow:
quote:
Originally posted by Tam al'Moff: [Cut
for *SPOILER*]. IMHO it would be just as easy to do a mail
shirt as it would to do a breast plate.
Um, dude, careful of *SPOLIERS* as don't forget CoT
is still very new and a lot of people wont have it yet.
There's a thread just below this one for discussions of the
book which specifies that it cotains spoilers. Any other
posts in threads about the new book should come with a
spoiler warning to be fair to those who haven't had a chance
to read it yet. WH and previous have been out more than long
enough to not bother doing that with of
course.
All of this is getting a bit far afield from my
original question: Does anyone have any suggestion on how to
stat the substance? Hardness and hit points for the material,
special qualities, like that. Not as armour, just as regular
things, like plates, cups, goblets, etc.
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JosephKell
Member Member # 99447
|
posted January 30, 2003 11:28 AM
your 250
hardness is a very good start! Anything that can do more than
250 damage deserves to mess up the stuff! (I can't even think
of anything that can do that
much!)
-------------------- Instant Message me @
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-If you cast Meteor
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Heron_Marked_Blade Member Member
# 110617
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posted January 30, 2003 11:31 AM
quote:
Originally posted by Whitewinds: All of
this is getting a bit far afield from my original question:
Does anyone have any suggestion on how to stat the
substance? Hardness and hit points for the material, special
qualities, like that. Not as armour, just as regular things,
like plates, cups, goblets, etc.
I would call it indestructible, plain and simple. I
seem to remember someone (a Black sister when Nynaeve captured
Moghedien the first time?) using a rod of balefire in a museum
that had lots of cuendillar items in it. Did it say something
then about the effects of balefire on heartstone? I don't have
my books with me.
Apart from possibly balefire, I would
consider cuendillar unbreakable. The weakening of the seals I
see more as corruption through the Dark One's touch rather
than overcoming hitpoints or hardness. The taint corrupted and
weakened the seals from within.
Woe betide the poor
fool who gets a cuendillar plate hurled at his head by an
angry woman....
On a slightly different note, how would
you treat weapons made out of cuendillar? Power Wrought +3,
unbreakable? The weapon would have to be masterpiece first, of
course....
[edit: learn to spell...]
[
January 30, 2003, 11:41 AM: Message edited by:
Heron_Marked_Blade
]
-------------------- "Suravye ninto
manshima taishite."
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aleshandre
Member Member # 27286
|
posted January 30, 2003 11:44 AM
Frankly,
for the sake of it being used for common items, just consider
it indestructable. if you intend to use it as armor, I'd add
DR of 12 (but only for full plate or other full coverage
chainmail) and no crits (except with blunt weapons against
chainmail). In all cases the only way we've seen it destroyed
is by the Dark One. If used in a partial coverage, add DR of
6, unless you're using called shots in which case, DR 12 is
appropriate for the covered location. Also if in partial
configuration, crits are possible if dismemberment is an
option in your campaign. ![[Wink]](Wizards_Com Boards Cuendillar (1)_fichiers/wink.gif)
-------------------- Stupidity is not a
crime, so you're free to go. Normal people frighten me.
I've never heard of freinds or relatives of serial killers
saying, "He was crazy, I knew he was going to snap sooner or
later and start killing people". They always seem to say, "He
was such a nice normal young man", etc. Atleast with
crazy people, you know to watch your back! My web page, new
& improved: http://geocities.com/aleshandre@sbcglobal.net/
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Shadowkiller
Member Member # 110597
|
posted January 30, 2003 11:49 AM
Heartstone
is indestructable. They say this multiple times in the book.
Any force at all used against it causes it to become stronger.
Any channeling into makes it stronger, hitting it makes it
stronger. They say this but nobody even incorperated
it.
Then you go further to say that just because it is
made from one material, it makes it harder to hit someone. Ok,
maybe cuendillar leather would but its not like the cuendillar
suddenly makes you harder to hit. Most people dont hurt
someone through armor in the first place, its all about
hitting the places that arent covered. Even in 3rd ed DnD, a
Mithril shirt does not make you harder to hit then normal
chain shirt, its lighter and has fewer restrictions. If
anything, thats what cuendillar would do. Plus you would never
need to repair it (The same as power wrought swords never
dulling). In 3rd ed, magic covers the holes and this is why
its harder to hit someone when the armor is magical.
In
the end, the books say that cuendillar is indestructable and
cuendillar armor would not protect you any better then normal
armor. Feel free to disagree, I'm just stating the facts as I
see them.
-------------------- Children of
the Dragon ^My Website^
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Melriken
Member Member # 48882
|
posted January 30, 2003 11:52 AM
um, lets
see here... Hardness: N/A Hit Points: N/A Heartstone
is indestructable, anything made of it fuses instantly so
inorder to make a multi-piece object you would need to bind
the pieced together with a different substance. Weaves of the
one power that are directed against or come into contact with
heartstone are unravled and thus it is immune to thier
effects. Weaves of the True Power (the darkone's power) are
rumored to affect the substance as normal, however this is as
of yet unconfirmed.
as for heartstone weapons and
armor, well usually I would just say they are indestructable,
do not need to be sharpened or polished. a suit of chain would
need to be made half of normal metal and half of heartstone, a
suit of plate would need leather straps and metal rivits to
hold it together. In any case I view heartstone as a ceramic
like material (just very thin and strong) and thus you would
need to put a lot of other stuff into plate armors to get the
pieces to slide against eachother correctly. I would make the
armor +2 and grant medium fortification, you can still get
crited, but it is a lot harder to do. The armor would also be
indestructable obviously. Weapons would be +1 if small, +2 if
medium, +3 if any larger size. Weapons would also be
idestructable.
hmm, I like this, I think I am gonna
write up a weave for creating it and send that off to the
netbook they are making... Is anyone else submitting to the
netbook? I can't wait to see the final
product.
-------------------- The prior post is in
no way intended to represent the thoughts and/or opinions of
the author. Read at your own risk.
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aleshandre
Member Member # 27286
|
posted January 30, 2003 11:59 AM
*****spoiler****** In CoT, when the cups fused
together, 2 girls were linked and attemting 2 cups
simultaneously. There may be a key in that. Also, the result
of the chain being changed to cuedillar is not known, it may
be in segments still; after all, Egwene is very strong with
earth. ![[Wink]](Wizards_Com Boards Cuendillar (1)_fichiers/wink.gif)
-------------------- Stupidity is not a
crime, so you're free to go. Normal people frighten me.
I've never heard of freinds or relatives of serial killers
saying, "He was crazy, I knew he was going to snap sooner or
later and start killing people". They always seem to say, "He
was such a nice normal young man", etc. Atleast with
crazy people, you know to watch your back! My web page, new
& improved: http://geocities.com/aleshandre@sbcglobal.net/
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JosephKell
Member Member # 99447
|
posted January 30, 2003 12:02 PM
Balefire
divides on Cuendillar like water on a wall. (Mmmmmmmm
Cuendillar Tower Shield... Cuendillar
Volvo...)
[ January 30, 2003, 12:03 PM: Message
edited by: JosephKell
]
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Jak Shadow
Member Member # 39941
|
posted January 30, 2003 01:04 PM
quote:
Originally posted by
aleshandre: *****spoiler****** In CoT, when
the cups fused together, 2 girls were linked and attemting 2
cups simultaneously. There may be a key in that. Also, the
result of the chain being changed to cuedillar is not known,
it may be in segments still; after all, Egwene is very
strong with earth.
*SPOLIERS*
Actually we DO know what
happened to the chain, check the link...
Book signing report at
wotmania
-------------------- "I'm not
feeling very well, it must be the anthrax." ~ Saturday
night Delta Green, GenCon UK
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Eagle Prince
Member Member # 67693
|
posted January 30, 2003 01:17 PM
You could
make heartstone chainmail, it would just take awhile because
you'd have to do each link individually, instead of instantly
transmuting the entire shirt. Same with field plate, it's
already different pieces hooked together with leather and
buckles/etc.
The way I remember it, power-wrought steel
was described a few times as being unbreakable (althought it's
already been proven that it can somehow be destroyed, as well
as heartstone); cuendillar I remember it only saying that
anything that tried to destroy it made it stronger.. never
unbreakable, just that it made it stronger. So I stand by same
hit points as steel (for obvious reasons), hardness of 40 and
all damage absorbed by the hardness gives it the same number
of temporary HP for 24 hours. Hmm.. I can remember first
reading Eye of the World, and thinking the way to destroy
heartstone would end up being somehow attacking it in a way
that you weren't making a direct attempt at destroying it. But
I was probably just reading too much into the
wording.
So from there, heartstone armor: must be made
of (nearly) all metal. Light gets +3 enhancement bonus w/
light fortification (25%), medium gets +4 enhancement w/
medium fortification (75%), and heavy gets +5 enhancement w/
heavy fortification (100%). Weapons: tiny/small +3 enhancement
(anything smaller not meaningfully effected), medium +4
enhancement, large or bigger +5 enhancement.
Finally,
hearstone made by saiden is black, hearstone made by saidar is
white.
[edit] Forgot the balefire/OP part. Anything
that grants you an armor bonus that is made of hearstone, you
still get to keep against touch attacks.
[
January 30, 2003, 01:23 PM: Message edited by: Eagle Prince
]
-------------------- I am the Immortal
One hidden from the dawn, I am the Emperor-King after day has
gone.
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aleshandre
Member Member # 27286
|
posted January 30, 2003 03:36 PM
Just being
nitpicky here, but the word is saidin, not saiden. The
last half of the word is din meaning brother, whereas; saidar
ends with dar meaning sister. I still haven't figured out the
meaning of the prefix sai, but I belive that it is either
related to strength or power. I think that the most likely
meaning is power, making the words compounds meaning literally
power of sister and power of brother. Ofcourse alantin also
means brother, but as Loyal said, it is very formal. We can
deduce that alantar would be the same form of the word
sister.
-------------------- Stupidity is not a
crime, so you're free to go. Normal people frighten me.
I've never heard of freinds or relatives of serial killers
saying, "He was crazy, I knew he was going to snap sooner or
later and start killing people". They always seem to say, "He
was such a nice normal young man", etc. Atleast with
crazy people, you know to watch your back! My web page, new
& improved: http://geocities.com/aleshandre@sbcglobal.net/
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Heron_Marked_Blade Member Member
# 110617
|
posted January 30, 2003 05:27 PM
quote:
Originally posted by aleshandre: I still
haven't figured out the meaning of the prefix sai, but I
belive that it is either related to strength or power. I
think that the most likely meaning is power, making the
words compounds meaning literally power of sister and power
of brother.
Any similarity to the sa in sa'angreal? Perhaps
in this case it indicates a greater degree of power? (power
[emphasis on high degree])'(angreal) What does angreal mean?
"Item"?
-------------------- "Suravye ninto manshima
taishite."
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aleshandre
Member Member # 27286
|
posted January 30, 2003 08:13 PM
Sa from
sa'angreal is related to sai in saidin/saidar, but it is
derivative of sai, not the other way around. I'm not sure
what angreal means, though I belive it has a strong reference
to focus possibly focal point, or concentration. There is
actually much that is left in grey areas in even the little
that we have. for example cuedillar is derivative of
cuebiyar which means heart, and it appears that dillar means
stone or rock, however; it still leaves much to be
interpreted. Like the fact that Shae'en m'taal means stone
dogs, but which word truely means stone and which dogs. If we
knew which the word of greater importance was in the name,
then we would know the answer, because the m' prefix means the
and specifically denotes importance (like in Machin Shin - The
Wind of Black and Mandhi - The Seeker). I would presume that
stone would have the greater significance, and that the plural
would be in dogs, which would make it Dogs of The Stone which
has implications of meaning that we can only speculate on
(like the one going through my mind now Dogs of the Stone of
Tear - they who would take the Stone). This being the case,
how do dillar and taal relate? Does one mean rock, or is heart
stone really the true interpretation? I suspect that dillar
does not truely translate as stone or rock, but this leaves
the question as to what it really means. ![[Big Grin]](Wizards_Com Boards Cuendillar (1)_fichiers/biggrin.gif)
[ January 30, 2003, 08:34 PM: Message
edited by: aleshandre
]
-------------------- Stupidity is not a
crime, so you're free to go. Normal people frighten me.
I've never heard of freinds or relatives of serial killers
saying, "He was crazy, I knew he was going to snap sooner or
later and start killing people". They always seem to say, "He
was such a nice normal young man", etc. Atleast with
crazy people, you know to watch your back! My web page, new
& improved: http://geocities.com/aleshandre@sbcglobal.net/
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